Hey Jawbones, how’s it going? Well, this is the sets I use. When I first get the dice, i set for all sevens. Once I make my point it is strictly Hard Ways with T5F4s. When trying to make my point I use the 3V set on the come out roll. Like you, I’m watching the dice til the dice come to me because I’m looking for the fives to be on top because it is easier to set the the 3V with T5F4 and just turn the right die over to make Left T5F4 and the right die T1F4. Two reasons why I set 3V after I make a point is first, I don’t want to hit a 7 and have people loss their come bets. Yeah only the flat bet from the come bets. And secondly, I want to try to make the 6 or 8 as my point. Thus having a better chance of hitting the 6 or 8 with the hard ways set.

I believe that the set is not as important as the condition we play in.

When you are at home you practice on one condition if you do not play on that same condition how can you expect to have the same results ?

Yes using the set that provides the best results for you is no doubt wise.

I believe knowing the condition you are going to be playing on and practicing on that condition is more important than anything else you do.

All shoots are not the same that is why when you get a group together that some may prefer different places to play, there shoot is better suited to a different condition.

Play on what you practice on.

I appreciate your input fourten and b-man but I am guessing that I wasn’t real clear as to my point. To clarify it a bit, if I decide to use a 3V set, I set it as T3:F5, T3F1. There are 7 other ways to set a 3V according to Frank and Dom in Cutting Edge Craps. My question really is: Are all 8 ways basically the same and it is just personal preference or is there a strategic reason to choose one over the other. I guess what I am getting at is as I expand my game into other sets to use in certain situations, do I need to learn all 8 ways to get a 3V or is just as effective to use the T3F5:T3F1 set?

Same for all the other sets: 2V, Hop 1-5, etc.

Again, I almost always use the hardway set T5:F4, T5F4 but as my control improves and as I get more input and info from smartcraps, I will use other sets occasionally

jb

Here’s the way I shoot and why I have been using this approach.
First there isn’t really any need to be face location specific for most people and certainly not for shot to shot selection. There are some to whom it may make a slight difference and those shooters will know this because of their practice and extremely complete record keeping. These shooters are more practiced and frankly better than most of us.
That being said, I think that the first thing that will lead you to an answer is by practicing and recording rolls in Smart Craps or some type of spread sheet that will differentiate between that specific faces on the L and R die. This will begin to tell you what your most common mistake and most common outcome is. My most common mistake is right die wobbles and tips over showing the inside face which translates to my most common outcome being top face L die and inside fave R die. If I use 5’s up with 3’s facing me my most common outcome is 5/1, easy 6. My most common primary is top faces followed closely by rear facing.
Since my most common mistake is R die tipping I NEVER use 3v and always use HW. I usually don’t alter my set from 5 up 3 facing however I don’t worry about it and will use whatever is easiest and fastest in the course of play since getting the shot off quickly is very important. During the hand if I am tossing well I might only change one of the dice if the other die combined with the inside face will equal my point but these decisions are done spur of the moment and are not something that I’m thinking about but I’ll do it if I notice it as the dice come to me. So in other words if I am in a hand and my point is 4 and I am tossing well and the dice come to me showing 6/3 I may change the 6 to another 3 with the 2’s facing which would give me a slightly better chance to show 3/1 of 2/2. I won’t look to do this but may do it if it presents it’s self.
Knowing what you are slightly more likely to show will tell you how to set the dice. 95% of the time I set 5 up 3 facing since I like 6’s but it really doesn’t make much difference and I will use any HW set if I feel like being quicker is important at that time.

Thanks Billy. That’s what I was looking for. I have over 11,000 recorded throws but I have not analyzed carefully what each die is doing. I am putting the first 1000 since the Advanced course into Smart Craps to further analyze them and will do blocks of 1000 going forward. That may shine a bit more light on which set to use if I vary from the Hardway set.

Thanks for taking the time to respond.

Just my own two cents. After practicing a great deal and looking at how my dice react, it has kind of distilled down for me to one main factor:
Am I able to keep the dice on axis? Be honest with yourself and see how the dice are actually reacting to hitting the table and bouncing off the back wall. We all know that ideally they will hit straight on and die. SmartCraps will certainly tell you that.Cutting Edge craps will also tell you the advantage that being on axis gives you with different number scenarios. I find real axis control is one of the keys because only then will I be able to use a specific set with any real reliability.
There are days when I can see my dice reacting well and then there are the days all of us know very well where they look like little ping pong balls and we start the good luck prayers.
Figure out for yourself how much energy and arch does it really take to reach the back wall. How much is too much? If I one day reach the level where I can reliably stay on axis consistently, then I will be more than willing to work on sets. Till then it is HW and SmartCraps. I may play the come out roll differently depending on where I am at in the roll. Because I do not play the Fire bet or the ATS it is of little interest to me. Like I say, that’s just my approach. I know how hard the basics are and why complicate something that’s already complicated enough. Good rolling to all of you.

Nope I understood what you where saying, I am saying that mastering the conditions you play on are way more important than the set, why?

If you do not have the condition down then your shot is nothing more than random, because you will have no control over the dice,So there for the set does not matter at all, I have played with you and you and, you are well on your way but master playing first then take it to the next level by mastering sets.

Point taken B-Man. I would say that my game is at a whole new level after many hours of additional practice and some pretty focused work on the mental part of the game. I am out of town for a couple of weeks and will be inputting data into Smart Craps as soon as I get back mid-February. That should provide some insight as whether my control is a higher level.

Thanks Doughboy for your input as well.

Jawbones,

I think you asked good questions. Even if you are not using this information " at the moment" or may even decide never to use it you are gathering food for thought from the experts here. It is never wrong to learn more about the game we all love. Keep seeking and you will keep advancing. 😎

Thank you for the kind words Getagrip.

I like to use more then one set . My reason may sound foolish to some . I think that it brings less heat to me at times . Then I have been told by a pit critter that on come out rolls is the only time I try to hit the back wall . By the way is not true .
I do change my throw a little on come out rolls and try to relax a little .Other then that I use the same set most of the time .
I feel that it is not the set as it is more about the grip and throw .
Good Rolling. 😀 😀