Craps

Something to discuss over this class weekend

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There doesn’t appear to be much discussion taking place this class weekend. I was to attend for the Refresher but life intervened and here I sit at home. So I want to start the minds of us not there working.

For a while I have been thinking about a “Natural” shooting position. It’s that one spot at the table where you can stand, pick up the dice, assume a good throwing stance, close your eyes and throw. No outside influencing factors, no staring at “The” spot you want to hit. No concentrating on the perfect anything, just imagining the throw in your mind and doing it. Just repeating the same throw over and over again, not worrying about the outcome just the form.

After establishing that spot you have a known distance, just like in shooting, I have a rifle a cartridge and a target at a known distance. After firing several rounds at this target and hitting it consistently I should be able to come back to it next week and hit it again.

Is it plausible to think that this process could lead you to your natural distance where you could just throw and hit the spot you were concentrating so hard on to begin with? Maybe Stick one (left or right) isn’t where you should be. Maybe its stick 1.5 or even 2.5.

Everybody is built differently. Doc’s taller and has longer arms than me. Finesse is shorter with shorter arms. Is Doc “short sheeting” his natural throw being at S1, is Finesse not close enough? I use these two fine gentlemen as examples only, they are both known to the majority of us. And while this line of thinking won’t assist them or the other accomplished shooters in our gang. It might be of use to the newbies or those struggling with the accuracy demon.

Take a 2 foot piece of tin foil and lay it on your table or receiving end length wise so you have a long landing zone. Weight down the corners so it won’t jump around. This will give you the ability to see where the dice are landing. Stand further back than you would normally practice at, 2 spots perhaps. Place five or more pairs where you can get to them easily.
Take up a good throwing position, pick up the pair as you do in practice or the casino. Align yourself as usual then close your eyes. Be comfortable and relaxed. See the throw in your mind’s eye and repeat it with your body. A nice relaxed throw. You should hear the dice hitting the tin, if it sounds like a glass window breaking or your spouse demands to know why you hit them with the dice there may be a bigger problem.

Repeat this several times. Are the dice all hitting in the same general area. If so then you may have found your natural throwing distance. And that distance will determine where you want to stand at a table so that you can drop the dice close to the back wall.

The same shot to the same target at the same distance over and over again, regardless of what shooting range or casino you’re at. No guess work involved.
Hope this helps those fighting demons.

Just want to get some discussion started on an otherwise slow weekend.


Replies:

Posted by: Finisher on September 23, 2015, 5:31 pm

It is ALWAYS slow when classes are going on . Even when they tried with comments during classes .I guess that did not go over well .
I was hoping to get to meet and greet but was unable to .
Did you try this with your gun to get that right range ? 🙂
I don’t know if this would work or not .
You are right that we all differ in were we stand and throw tho .
Good Rolling. 🙂 🙂

Posted by: Finisher on September 25, 2015, 5:20 am

You have 89 views with me the only one that posted a reply . I guess nobody wants to try this out . When you shoot do you use a scope or not ?
Why would you want to shoot at the same distance all the time . I find that what you are shooting at may not always be at that spot . ( OR DISTANCE .)
For some reason when I throw straight down like they teach in class I get shorter rolls with a lot of 3/4 and 2/5s .So I throw at a slight angle off to the left and get longer rolls .I try to stay out of mixing bowel area tho .
I will have to take another class to find out what I am doing wrong . But FIRST will have to convince the wife that I need it .
When I went hunting it seemed that ever thing ran from me so they were not at that range that I was use to .Last time I went hunting we had 13 dogs with us so it did not matter much . 🙂 🙂
Boy that was a long time ago .Like 1966 .
Maybe 65 .
Like Bman says shoot with glued dice and a 6in bowel .
You can adjust the distance then if you want .
I find that some times I have a tendency to push the dice out of my hand instead of just letting them come out on their own .
I guess that is like pulling the trigger rather then squeezing it .
Hope some one can add more to this post .
Good Rolling. 🙂 🙂

Posted by: FourTen on September 25, 2015, 6:45 am

I just finished taking the refresher course in Vegas. As in both the Primer and Refresher courses we are taught to throw from S1. The only problem I see is that EVERYBODY and their mother and even people that just see videos on youtube that don’t take classes from GTC wants S1 or S2. So we are told to either play PAI GOW or Video Poker til S1 or S2 is open or go home. Well, that’s not my cup of Tea. My goal, just like everybody else is to be good enough to throw from ALL spots on the craps table. So, this is In My Own Opinion and what I’m thinking of doing is practice, practice, practice at home from S1. So when I go to the Casinos I’ll make every possible attempt to find a S1 spot. If I can’t, then I’ll go to one of my favorite spots, those are either ENDS of the table. So, my betting will not be as aggressive as it would be when I’m on S1 or S2. Yes I know I might not be doing as good as if I would of been on S1 or S2 BUT I’m learning to throw from the ends in which there are ALWAYS opening there and can be a blocker as well. I figure if I can use the same grip, and improvise my swing then eventually I’ll get it. Yes and at some expense for learning to shoot at the ends of the table. But as soon as I see that S1 or S2 is coloring up then I’m taking my chips over to S1 or S2.

Posted by: Finisher on September 29, 2015, 5:34 pm

I just hate it when some one takes those spots and then does not even throw the dice .There is a player at Rio that does this and stays ALL day he throws only when everybody is having a bad day . He told me that he likes to be able to see all his bets right in front of him so that is why he plays there .It is easier to tell the dealer what he wants in that spot .
One time I asked him if he could move over a little so I could be at l1 and he ended up with all his chips over the table . I felt real bad about that and never asked again .
If he is in that spot I just go away now .
Hope you get better at the hook .
Good Rolling. 🙂 🙂

Posted by: OneMoonCircles on September 29, 2015, 9:48 pm

Sometimes when only half a table is open for the stick left folks I will go all the way over next to the dealer and throw left-handed from there. I have had generally decent results.
I square up and just throw normally. From the end of the table I throw by curling my wrist straight towards me and get as much room as I can with my height and give a nice toss toward the end and have also had some decent rolls from there. Be conservative in your betting until you see if you are getting the results you desire.

OMC

Posted by: Butcher on October 5, 2015, 2:31 am

I would agree with some of your observations. I have a 12′ table that I practice on at home. I find that on some of the casino tables I have been on recently my shot is a little short of my target. Following my last trip I started working on varying my shot distance. I set-up at SL1 placing a target, (a 3"x3"piece of tinfoil), about 6" from the wall. After 10 throws or so I move to SL3 and repeat 10 throws. What I am trying to do is get a "feel" for different distances for when I have chips to avoid or have to throw from SL2 or 3. Using the tinfoil helps me verify the dice are landing flat. I can’t control the length of the table or the exact spot I have to play from but I hope that through practice I can learn to make slight changes in the distance my shot travels without sacrificing axis control. The advanced class covers how to make changes in distance and launch angle. As far as staring down the target and using the firearm analogy. When I was trained(military) in how to shoot sight picture was a big deal. Don’t stare down the target. Aquire the target and take the shot. Just my 2c

Posted by: OneMoonCircles on October 5, 2015, 4:56 am

Each table being a little different in bounce and length I think it would be hard to get just one position. We have one very bouncy table, 4 14-footers one of which is a crapless.
Then there are always crowded tables, 2 casinos and soon a third as soon as their expansion is complete. Another has 2 tables, sometimes very crowded and sometimes empty,
or one crowded and one empty. The 2 fourteen foot tables and their sister casino with a 12′ are almost unplayable due to the nastiness of the dealers. These folks moved
here from Las Vegas and have a whole different attitude. The 12′ is actually a decent if you can get past the ugliness of the crews to play there. Not my cup of tea. The rest of the tables here are ok with one exception due to poor maintenance. I have played there when the felt was shot and had a big hole in it for months before they replaced it.

Learn the tables where you want to play and keep a record of each tables’ characteristics. That is something I just recently started. Seems to work.

OMC