Craps

Table Designs – another lesson. Inspect the table first!

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I was in Kansas City at a hotel casino that I won’t name other than the name starts with one of the first letters in the alphabet. After a night with some crazy rolls that a made a few bucks (one nice 36 roll) I thought I could go back and do it again. No way the crazy moving dice all went the other way. Which reminded me of the post were someone said to pay more attention to how the dice are moving then the outcome. Good outcomes the night before but they were not moving as they should have based on my roll.

Well after a very frustrating night of returning my winning plus I was more confused then ever. So the next morning I was up early before the tables were staffed and checked then out. When I tapped hard on the end of the table I found a drum like box not a typical at all and it ran down the center of the table as far as I could reach. Around the outside edges there was a very hard material about eight to ten inches wide. And at the end infront of the rubber it was very hard for about two inches. Then I looked at the rubber and it was not square vertically and the pyramids went all the way down to the table top. So the crazy bounces off of the landing zone ran fast as soon as they got off the box. When they landed on the border between the drum and the hard out area they bounced completely different from eaach other. This is in an area some people select for their landing zone. When the dice landed close to the back the angles rubber slammed the dice to a weird stop right next to where the table and rubber met. Then I notices the weird curve in the rubber and the way it wrapped around the back wall on a weird curve. Lesson learned. Nice rooms.


Replies:

Posted by: Dr Crapology on January 26, 2013, 4:21 pm

A great post. I find that the great members of this site all have great ideas and information that we can all use. As Dom says GTC is like a family. Thank you for sharing.

Doc and Alligator Rose

Posted by: Finisher on January 27, 2013, 1:14 am

I DON’T think that there are any regs on tables. So you can find all kinds of STUFF out there. I am not good at looking things over very well but have seen some strange things about different tables. Like one looked like an old wash board that my mother used to wash my cloths when I was little.
If it looks different I would stay away from it. Or at least watch others throw for awhile.

When I went to Pa. for a trip I watched awhile because the first thing I saw was a throw that hit one end and then the other end and land in front of all the chips in reach of the stick. It is that the steel workers are strong I guess.
Good Rolling. 😀 😀

Posted by: brothelman on January 27, 2013, 2:19 am

I t could of been the release.

Dice doing funny things are a big indictator that your release is way off or maybe the arm swing.

Then there is one more thought gremlins,demons,rumpulminze, that table is so out of wack i would not put it by them.

lmao.

Posted by: The Breeze on January 27, 2013, 4:53 am

In the future I am going to check out the pyramids first and if I see something there that seems off I am going to assume that there will be other things off as well. I typically only get to play while traveling for work so it makes it hard to get in the casinos early in the morning and physically check out the tables but I certainly am going to make an effort to do so when I can. And I am going to try and get my play in when I am fresh and in good mindset verses racing to the casino directly after work. I may have had a temporary release issue but I have now installed a miror on my practice rig to get a better view of my release. And I keep thinking about the post where it was mentioned to look and the performance of the dice and not the outcome. Had I done so I would have taken my winnings and never gone back to that table. Just have to keep working on that learning curve and apply what I have learned from GTC.

Posted by: CC Roller on January 27, 2013, 5:09 am

I just returned from a 14 day cruise, Will not mention the cruise line or where we went, but had a great time.

Now on the first day, before leaving port, I went to the Casino and checked their table. As I put my hand over the felt to the right of the stick position, I felt a small ridge under the felt about 12 inches from the end, near the pass line. This was only at one end. This was good to know as I saw many a die land in that area and fly all over.

As I can toss from SL1/2 and SR1/2, usually tossed at the SR spot.

Yes I was up on the cruise. but didn’t play that much, as I like to enjoy all aspects of the cruise and we had a storm on the last 5 days, that caused a slight rolling motion to the ship.

CC Roller

Posted by: Stealthman on January 27, 2013, 2:51 pm

In the Denver area, one of the tables we went to we all felt the table while talking to the crew. No one else was there so we talked for awhile. Since they were not going to open the table fully until nighttime, we went elsewhere. NOW, we all commented when we left that the felt was stretched so tight that in the center it was like a trampoline. I thought about a half inch off the table. Wow!

Posted by: The Griz on January 27, 2013, 4:51 pm

Another sports analogy… This time fly fishing. A really good fisherman does not just park and wade into the water, he/she sits and studies the water, current, eddies and any flies possibly hatching, and if course any fish that may be rising. The patient, observant person catches the fish. Good analogy for the tables… Don’t be in a hurry and study the table as much as you can! Good "catch" Richard!
Fish ON!

Posted by: Guest on January 28, 2013, 6:42 am

There are 2 casinos here that offer the repeat bet. A very poor return for the money unless you can roll and repeat the same point at least 3 times. I noticed that tossing to the corner had a very good result – dice sat down and moved maybe 1-2 inches off the wall if you threw to the hook. Not so if you shot down the middle. Any player who made more than one point was shooting into the hook.
Clark

Posted by: Finisher on January 28, 2013, 7:17 am

What is the repeat bet. Sounds like what we try to do . REPEAT NUMBER AFTER NUMBER.
Good Rolling. 😀 😀

Posted by: The Breeze on January 28, 2013, 4:10 pm

Lois and Clark

I have seen some pretty good results from people shooting into the corners but have always tried to keep it down the center but when I thought about the table in Kansas City, the only good surface was about a foot square in the corners. If you could get height and some decent back spin the corners on some of these table might be the place to land. Maybe worth a try but in the big picture I am going to try and avoid the engineered tables and certainly look a little harder to understand what I am watching. The problem I have had in some casinos when trying to observe the table is that the people are not rolling they are crazy throwing so it is hard to understand what the table is doing and what the throw is doing.

Off to Albuquerque for another shot this week.

Posted by: ACPA on January 28, 2013, 4:29 pm

Finisher,

Repeat bet is like the fire bet, it has to be a point established and made, but instead of having to make all six points this pays you for coming out and making the same points. I don’t remember the payoff but think you have to make the same point at least four times to get paid.

You can get specifies at www.wizardofodds.com.

Noah

Posted by: Guest on January 28, 2013, 6:21 pm

Noah I think they pay on the third time. It is what we try to do. The two tables where they have this bet are very bouncy in my opinion. I only know one shooter who can tame these tables and he is not GTC.
Clark

Posted by: MarkM3 on January 29, 2013, 8:01 pm

While doing a tour with Lois and Clark at a few downtown Vegas casinos we came across a table that from about 12" out from the back wall was ripples under the felt that made dice do goofy things. I asked stickman what was the purpose, he says to keep people from sliding the dice, asked had he ever had seen this "sliding" done before, as I have asked several dealers, not one has seen this action yet. 🙄

Posted by: Diceman on January 29, 2013, 9:24 pm

The Diceman Cometh . . .

Big Daddy Guy and I met two players in SBC who tried the sliding method. They were members of another camp, and the slide is what they were taught! They drank the kool aid, and tried, however, their "slide" was no more than a random roll. They were also taught to hit the back wall HARD! Oh well. A waste of time, money, and effort.

Posted by: Dominator on January 30, 2013, 2:19 pm

It is always a good idea to check out a table. It is also a good idea to remember a table that works well for you. Even in the same casino some tables are better than others

Dominator