Yeah, what happened cuz inquiring minds want to know. 😉

Hearing was most interesting. We went to the Las Vegas gaming Control Board offices . High security and name badges given. We were brought into a room with a larger attorney style conferance table. A 52 inch TV screen that was paused with me shooting, Billy’s cool white cap and Doms hands.

We also where introduced to the Gaming control adjutacator, V.P. of all Casinos in Vegas tied to the one we were there for, One female attorney, The PitBoss that was behind the table and the Gaming control Badge guy that took our complaint. (he did not look happy to be there)

We were sworn in. We all gave our testimony. Believe it or not Dom did NOT loose his cool and gave a great point of view. We all reviewed the video in real time, slow motion time, then back to an overhead view that was the worst clarity ever. We went back to the right end camera angles to explain about the dice and what they looked like.

The control board did have dice and chips set up that was showing the leaning on the chips. Dom had a towel to show the display better as the dice keep slipping off. My input was that the rules state that the camera needs to show table, players and be clear enough to show the integrity of all wins, losses and outcomes. (All was blurry but we did see the pipps.

Was very complete I guess but the final determanation will be out first week in January, 2016. They say its "our burdan of proof" Well their cameras and their people. As Dom said the stick was so hesitant of call but when the supervisor said 7 out the push of the dice showed a 5-3.

So ya all. Thats it. As the others left ahead of me, I got in elevator and who follows? -the Casino VP, attorney and supervisor. I said interesting hearing but are we all Welcome in your Casinos? They said of coarse. (will see about that)

So, Dom might add more from his thoughts but that is the jist of it.

Good fortune to all our GTC friends.

Nick@Night

Must have been an interesting experience. From your description it looks like the (blurry) pictures indicate that the cameras are not real high tech as is indicted in Hollywood movies concerning casinos.

Rose and Doc will hope for a favorable ruling. If we have any doubts, we (Doc especially) think the casinos just might have the Gaming Control people in their back pocket—but that is a very undocumented opinion.

Look forward to early January and the decision. Do keep us posted.

"Dr Crapology" wrote: If we have any doubts, we (Doc especially) think the casinos just might have the Gaming Control people in their back pocket—but that is a very undocumented opinion.

It’s not some sinister hidden conspiracy, it’s a fact. The GCBs are there to protect the interests of the casinos. That does mean protecting them from employees who may be incompetent or cheating. They may be fair to players (or vendors, or employees), but the reason the control board employees have jobs is because the casinos exist as businesses.

I think it’s similar to auditors who work over a company’s books: they’re paid by the company, so unless there’s a wild discrepancy that would affect the auditor’s reputation, why bother roasting them over minutia? For this reason, I’m not terribly optimistic about a favorable ruling for our friends involved here. In the universe of reasons the GCB would rule against a casino, this is a pretty minor infraction, even though it seems large from the players’ side.

seven yes or no

We have three tubs we play at and the some times both dice have to hit the back wall, some times
one die has to hit the back wall. Sometimes you swear every time there is a close call on a 7
it is always a 7. From time to time we have asked for a review and it always come back a 7.
So we quit asking………………….But

Over the course of the past couple of years we have noticed something else.. there have been
times it appears a number did not hit the back wall and they call it good, or if it is a close 7 they
call it a short roll, There are times when you have a come bet up and a 7 is thrown on the
come out and they don’t take it down.

I cant get In the head of the dealers to say they extend you the benefit of the doubt if you play
there a lot or tip well…. but what I can say is there is a difference between casino’s and crews
as to how well and fairly your treated.

We are very lucky in Wisconsin I think to have some good playing conditions.

gman

Give me a few days and I will write my impressions and thoughts. Been very busy with GTC business since coming back.

Dom

First let me say as the old expression goes, “You can’t beat City Hall”

The good news is that our play at the craps tables was great. We all had great rolls and came home with money! We also scouted some old casinos for new places to play and found some.

Now the bad news …. When we were first interviewed by the agent for the NGC (Nevada Gaming Commission) on the day of the claim he told us that he worked for us, the player, and not the casino … what a bunch of bull! As Nick stated the casino brought in an expensive attorney, the Senior VP of table games for 5 of their properties and the floor supervisor that was at the table. And the SVP had the gall to say that they were not there for the money but to have a fair game.

We were all sworn in. Little good did that do. The video was completely blurred. At one point the SVP said “See that die is unquestionably a 4!” …. At which point I said, “We all can agree that the video is blurred, but there is a pip on each corner of the die and one in the middle. Thinking back to second grade math, 5 dots are a 5 not a 4!” Just crazy!

I said that this case is a “she said, he said” case … that the video is inconclusive, that we had 3 witnesses present and the casino only had the floor supervisor and the video was blurred. The adjudicator said that I have said this many times before during the hearing and that we had the burden of proof. This is when I knew we were dead. Patrons can’t take videos in a casino, (I was stopped once at Bellagio for doing this), so what evidence can we bring in except our testimony under oath.

As Nick said, we will hear by January 7th, 2016. As which time the adjudicator said that we could take this to a court hearing if the ruling was not in our favor, but it would cost us to do so. Lately I have been thinking that I just might. I just can’t stand that the floor guy lied through his teeth saying that he made the call when we all know it was the stickman that made the call and flicked the die as the floor guy came over. He made such a big stink that the video showed his watch and so he had to make the call. He said that the leaning die was on the odds bet and not on the pass line bet. I said I have never seen a die go off the back wall and instead of rolling forward it would roll backward! Just a joke! I would never have taken this case this far if I wasn’t 110% sure that we were wronged!

What did we learn …. The videos are truly bad in the casinos. All gaming commissions, like when we sued the Mississippi gaming Commission and won, all work for the casinos.

It was an experience

Dominator

Thanks for the report Dom.

Was wondering.

Truth is, we have all probably spent too much time, effort and thought on this — and I only spent the time to write the post. Good excuse to go back to Vegas but not really worth the time to pursue further just to make some lying bastard live up to his lie — which would not happen even if you won in court.

The only way to go is to have fun with it by playing there again and killing them. 🙂

Time to move on.

Hmmm, would have been interesting to ask for a live feed from that camera to compare the clarity; lots of time elapsed to Dr. the video…. just sayin’. Seems useless to have crappy video.

Why work so hard to make them wrong? too much effort. Better to spend your time putting a bowl at the optimum landing spot on your table and throw dice into it for an hour.

Out of 100 how many can the people on this board make.

I find I can do a majority but constantly need to practice it or that deteriorates.

Hard Nine – it was a live video that we saw in real time as well as in slow motion.

Jes, practicing I do! People who think that I can just let an injustice go don’t know me. When you have been banned as many times, trespassed as many times as I have, had people pushed away from you by security jerks that think they are cops as I have, and just plain treated like crap at numerous casinos, there becomes a part of you that just wants to get back at them.

This might all be inconsequential because on January 7th, the NGC might just do the right thing

Lets wait and see

Dom

I can understand that.

Maybe you will get a late present.

JJJ

Dom,

I meant a live feed from that very camera on what was going on now, during your hearing, not the recording of the roll, just to compare the camera without having a chance to alter the recording to the camera during your play.

Jes, It’s a discussion board, I discuss between practice sessions! 😀