Good Post. Wisconsin Gaming Commission has 12 pages on the rules of craps. On page 11 it defines the that the side opposite the side resting on the chips or object shall be considered uppermost and skyward, therefore being the number to call.
Thanks for the reminder to know the rules.

vegas will rule the same way the number opposite of the number resting on what ever impeded its downward motion will be called.

It is like this gravity!

they will study and decide well.the stick should be reprimanded.

The Colorado rule is as the Wisconsin rule with the following, " if the dice is touching two sides it shall be a no roll". I protested one as the dealer moved chip stack and caused a change in the outcome. After review and consideration (the Pit Boss didn’t know what the hell the rule was) he sort of ruled in my favor but still got it wrong. This was after the camera people didn’t know either! It should have been an 8 for the point but
the call was 7 out. Pit boss said let’s call it a "6", pay the bets that were on the six. The thrower then was given the dice again (the stickman said please hit an 8) the thrower put $5 on hard eight and rolled it!

Colorado has about 13 pages of rules and about 30 pages defining the side bets of craps like the fire bet,
all, tall, small and so on. This includes the payouts that must be made. 95% of the dealers, pit critters
and surveillance personnel haven’t a clue here! Some thought it was "the natural roll of the dice", (decided by whom?) Couldn’t define natural roll other than to say "the normal outcome expected". It actually is comical to me.

If a call is in my favor but wrong I don’t say anything. If their call is wrong and not in my favor I call it to their attention.
I am nice but firm. If you ask them to check the spy in the sky they are happy to get off the hook, so to speak.

You didn’t say but I am assuming the call was 7 out, is that correct? You should win.

I am working on a plan to submit changes in our rules shortly after the 1st of the year. We will see
how it goes.

OneMoonCircles

Yes, the call was 7 out.

Rules can differ from state to state and actually casino to casino. They gave us two explanations as to why the denial and one contradicted the other. In Vegas the casino needs to have all their rules posted and if not posted to bring the rules down to the patrons to show them during a discrepancy. They did not show it to us. Actually the Gaming agent asked us if they did. We really thought this gaming agent was on our side….. obviously not. He actually said to us , -Quote- "I am sure you are not surprised that %$#$ (this casino) has been questioned by us for these type of infractions in the past." end quote

I am sick and tired of being harassed, banned, and trespassed at all the casinos around the country. Not sure if anything was said on the site about what happened to me and Billy in a casino in Atlantic City this past seminar, but I am just plain PI^%$’ssed off! That incident in AC was just plain crazy and I have written to the people in charge about it as well.

Before Ed Thourp wrote his book on card counting, blackjack was a dead game. Before dice control came to the forefront so was craps. This stick person didn’t like that we were using our techniques, he wanted to call a 7 out and flicked the offending die away from the chips that was holding it up before the floor supervisor could see the outcome, ….. another thing in the Nevada rule books and also the rule they quoted to us in our denial that was not done.

They thought we were going to do the hearing over the phone. When I called them to say that we wanted the video tape to be there and that we were flying in they were shocked! They will have the video there and maybe we are wrong …. maybe what we thought we saw wasn’t what had happened. I strongly don’t think so, but I will not let this go by without a fight. Give us a fair game is all I ask.

Stay tuned

Dominator

Dominator,

Thanks for filling us in on this. I think the dice community does need to know when this type of thing happens and especially when it is taken so far. I would also like to know, as I am sure many others would, about the AC incident.
I also know that usually you do not agree when a specific casino is named in a report on this forum and 99% of the time I whole heartedly agree with that. Maybe this is the 1% when you should name names. That way we are all aware and can vote with our feet and not play at these places or at the very least be even more watchful of the crew and box on payouts etc. when we play there. If you do decide you want to name the casinos then I would also like to know the time of day you all had this problem. I see SO much variation at casinos between shifts and how they handle things. Not sure how the casinos policies can be handled so differently. You would think they would agree on one way per the rules and at least run all shifts accordingly at that casino.

Well, I hope I haven’t overstepped my boundaries here with my comments and thanks again for giving us this information. I will certainly be interested in any updates. Anything we can do to help, just let us know!

All I have to say is kick some ass boys. These casinos and bosses need to know that they can not bully patrons around. Especially the GTC people. Take em down!

Midnight

Similar incident just occurred while I was at table in Bossier. Di was right in front of me, from opposite end. Tilted on money, call made, uproar of NOOOOO. Handled quickly by box lady….slid money, Di dropped, correct call. If it had just wiggled a little, it would have moved. Didn’t like it, but she was right. Same table earlier, she had stick pass a player’s turn. He had been sitting down, on phone while dice went around table. He had a previous good roll. Table was full, and that end was not happy. She explained it to him well, and then moved the dice. She was exactly right. This Casino has a tremendous number of "young turks" who only want to shoot their $5 pass line. If they did not control this there would be even more. Don’t blame the young guys (read street hustlers) but they will learn. They NEVER give me problems, and I get in on less than half, sometimes all the way around table before I get in. They know (I told them) I use some kind of SYSTEM to QUALIFY a shooter. 5 count has been in my pocket for a long time.

Shoot with passion….and pay attention
DavidM

Great hearing from you Dave….Hope all is well with the family!

Dom

Dom, thanks for asking. Yes all is well, my wife (dreamed of you and Frank during my first class) graduates as Nurse Practitioner in Dec. & Dad will be 96.
I want to thank you and the guys for posing for the picture, while in Shreveport. We all looked tired, Doc looked good.
Shoot with passion…everytime.
DavidM

We are here in Vegas and our hearing is tomorrow at 1:00 PST.

Can’t wait!

Dominator

I can’t wait to here the entire story and just what they have to say. It would be great to have a Video Tape of this event.

This is going to be SO GOOD!!!!!! Have fun guys! Can’t wait for the post mortem!

Look forward to hearing the results. Hope it is successful and you kicked their collective behinds. They go out and play with some long rolls.

Rose and Doc