I try to warm my arm up on the type of table that I will be playing on as well. I bet the minimum on the Don’t and the minimum on the Passline with $1.00 on any 12 for the come out roll. When I feel comfortable I will start to bet the Big Skinny way and if I am hitting many of the same numbers I will sometimes put a little over the minimum on that number as well. When I feel tired I take down my bets and use a few come bets with smaller odds.

Last night I went to a casino and the best I could do was three point numbers. My throw was off and the dice where not landing flat so I only used come bets. I was with the wife and she just tosses them down the middle. I didn’t win at the tables last night and I was very disappointed but I realize I can’t win all the time. I lost $70.00. One of my good friends, Tommy, put money on the 12 and hit it. Not only did he hit it but he pressed it up and hit it 2 more times in a row. I don’t know the total amount of money but it was "BIG"!!! 😯 So big that all the employee at the table where yelling at the top of their lungs with Tommy. Crazy night out last night. Tommy knew he would hit the twelve, and I could see it in his eyes and facial expressions when I was watching him toss the dice. But, I don’t bet those numbers so I didn’t bet it with him. About 1 year ago Tommy and I met up at a casino and we got really lucky and he reminded me of that night just before he tossed those 12’s. We both had really long rolls that night and we won thousands hitting box numbers. I told him that was the night I used 3,6 on top and 1,5 facing me and 3,2 on top and 1,4 facing me. I would change from one to the other if I barely escaped the seven on that roll. That was before GTC classes and it was all luck because I remembered praying that night. 😛

If your friend continues to bet the 12 on a consistent basis let’s see where he is in 12 months. My money is that he will have lost the money on the 12 he won as you outlined and much more.

Just my $.02 worth.

Doc

7×7,

You are giving up way to much house edge betting like that. Your pass and don’t pass is 2.8% house edge. Then factor in like 10% for the 12.
You are not saving any money betting like that.

Just place a Passline bet with single odds until you settle in.

NFF

NFF,

EagleEye is the one suggesting the simultaneous Pass, DontPass and 12 bets on come-out.
My scenario is, if my throw doesn’t look good and it may need some warm-up,
I would bet the Don’tPass on the come-out and switch my set from the hardways
to the all-7’s and expect to win some chips during this warm-up.
As soon as my throw looks good then I would switch back to normal play with
Passline and come bets. On an empty table, so as not to upset other players.

7×7

I don’t give a hoot about upsetting the other players. If there are other controlled shooters playing I might clue them in as to my intentions.

I always carry my WUB on casino trips. It is a warm up box, it fits in my carry on and unfolds to sit on the bed and catch the dice. I use the adjustable ironing board for a throwing station. I carry 10 pairs of dice and a gripper. Ido throw more tosses on the WUB then on the real table.
I am just minutes from warmup to table.

Goldfinger

Sorry 7×7,

I misread the thread.

I do not have an issue with betting very small and conservatively if your toss is not good.

Whether you bet Pass or Don’t Pass is immaterial.

NFF

"Eagle Eye" wrote: I try to warm my arm up on the type of table that I will be playing on as well. I bet the minimum on the Don’t and the minimum on the Passline with $1.00 on any 12 for the come out roll.

NFF has already explained that this is a bad way to play. Let me put it into monetary terms so that you see what is happening and give you a better alternative than the way you are betting if you want to warm up. Since you are warming up I am going to treat your rolls as random and use the odds for a random roller in calculating what you can expect.

Let us say you are at a $5 table betting your way. You have $5 on the Pass, $5 on the Don’t Pass and $1 on the 12 on every come out roll. If you throw a 7, 11, 2, 3 or 12 on the come out you replace the $1 on the 12 because you will still be on a come out roll. Once you establish a point you stop betting the $1 on the 12.

In 36 rolls you can expect to throw one 12 and thirty-five other numbers. Thus you can expect to win $30 once and lose $35 the other thirty-five times for a net loss of $5 with your $1 wager on the 12.

The Pass and Don’t Pass wagers will cancel each other out for a net win/loss of $0 the thirty-five times you do not throw the 12. When you throw a 12 you will lose the $5 Pass and push the $5 Don’t Pass for a net loss of $5. I took into account the win on the 12 in the above sentence. I am only looking at the Pass and Don’t Pass wagers in this sentence.

So with 36 random rolls, you can expect to lose $10 on average betting your way.

As a better alternative, I would suggest you wager the minimum on only the Pass or only the Don’t Pass (as NFF has already mentioned).

The House Advantage on the Pass is 1.41% and 1.36% on the Don’t Pass.

If you bet $5 on the Pass by itself you will wager a total of $180 in 36 rolls. Your expected loss is .0141 X $180 = $2.54.

If you bet $5 on the Don’t Pass by itself you will wager a total of $180 in 36 rolls. Your expected loss is .0136 X $180 = $2.45.

Would you rather lose approximately $2.50 or $10? The answer is obvious. What is not so obvious is that it is better to only bet the Pass of Don’t Pass rather than both of them because it seems like they offset each other except on the rare (1 out of 36) occasions when you roll a 12 on the come out. But as you can see from the numbers, that small chance will be very costly, especially over the long term.

When you warm up pick either the Pass or Don’t Pass. Bet the minimum and you will save yourself money in the long run.

The math tells you what to do and so does GTC. Follow our advice if you want to become an advantage player.

7X7

You are putting way too much thought going into the game if you are playing the don’t and changing up your dice sets. Remember that your mind must be clear and you must get immediately into your zone. Play just like you practice everyday and forget about short term changes during a warm up period. I always prefer empty tables to throw on and racking up the profits before the table gets crowded with leaches. Keep up the good work.

A note to new readers of this board. We had a few students that pulled out dice from their pocket and warmed up on an empty (closed) table. Never have your dice in your pocket or pull this crazy stunt in a casino. They were immediately escorted out of the casino by security and buried in the desert some where on the NV/CA state line. 😉

An empty table in this post means an open table with dealers ready to open up the game when the first person buys in.

Dice Pilot,
That is too incredible.
Shooting in an open casino on a closed table !!! Anyone who saw the movie Casino would understand what happens to those who do such things in a casino.
But, this leads me to ask what happens on a cruise ship? Some have suggested here that if the casino is closed on a cruise ship it is OK to go to the table and throw with your own dice as a warm up.
I happen to be going on a cruise soon….I wouldn’t want to end up swimming for the shore!!!
So it may be that on a cruise ship, WHEN the CASINO is CLOSED, you can practice with your own dice
Anyone with knowledge of this please check in.

We were playing in South Louisiana 2 years ago. I jokingly told the Boxman I needed to warm up on the empty table. He said go ahead he did not care. The rest of the crew told him he could not do that it was against the rules. He said the boss was gone and he could do as he wished. To this day I do not know if he was joking or not, but I knew I did not want to end up as alligator bait.

You are a man of high intelligence, indeed, Tommy C. Good choice.

I’ve been on cruise ships where the casino is closed and I’d bring my dice to practice on their table. Nobody has ever said a word.

Randman

That certainly is good news. Will try on my cruise. Thanks.

I would like to thank all the post on this topic. I’ve been hitting full tables and getting 10 to 15 rolls per hour. My casino opens their tables at 10am. This weekend I’m planning on getting there about 9am; get some breakfast and just relax until they open and then hopefully have an empty table to warm up on. I have also been betting $5 with $25 odds. I’m now going to bet $5 with $10 odds until my throw feels good. Thanks.

"Busman3845" wrote: I would like to thank all the post on this topic. I’ve been hitting full tables and getting 10 to 15 rolls per hour. My casino opens their tables at 10am. This weekend I’m planning on getting there about 9am; get some breakfast and just relax until they open and then hopefully have an empty table to warm up on. I have also been betting $5 with $25 odds. I’m now going to bet $5 with $10 odds until my throw feels good. Thanks.

I tried just to get the sentence that I wanted but did not happen sorry .
I am confused about 10 to 15 rolls per hour. Is it that you get the dice that number ? If the table is full it may take awhile before the dice get back. If there are only 10 to 15 rolls per hour the casino is in trouble. They make their money on lots of throws . That is why they want you to set fast .
Good Rolling. 😀 😀

Thanks Skinny,NFF, and all others for good info. I will bet either or next time. I am still learning from you guys. Sorry, seventimesseven for not so good advice. Skinny, I got my mojo back. I won alot of money tonight. Using the H.W. Set. I received a tip for $200.00 by one guy. I didn’t win the amount of money the guy at right stick won. He had almost $800.00 a number with $200 & $300 hardways. It was one of my best rolls ever. I followed Dom’s advice and played at the casino that I do best at. I am so excited I can not even go to bed and I am trying. 😀

I know there are differing opinons on this.

Cruise ships or otherwise, I don’t think anyone should take their dice into a casino or practice or warm up on a closed table. This should be done privately, in your room, etc.

As Billy the Kid often says, "JDLR" – This Just Doesn’t Look Right.

It is also not following GTC’s 20 Commandments.

Is doing so "less wrong" on cruise ships? It doesn’t matter. Regardless of getting permission beforehand, in-casino "practice" will attract unwanted attention from security and other casino or cruise ship personnel.

Rest assured that if their bottom line takes hit from those "warming up", the practice will quickly come to a screeching halt and will likely be followed by a no dice setting rule, as has happened in the past.

Like it or not, we are all ambassadors of GTC. Good or bad, our actions as skilled shooters are being watched by both casino personnel and other players and will affect those who may follow us.

Know your edge, trust your shot, make only smart, low HA bets that fit your bankroll and skill level.

Practice in private. As the 20 Commandments say, act like a regular player and don’t wear out your welcome.

That’s the GTC way and also the smart advantage play.

Just my opinion, however. I could be wrong…

😎 😎 😎

Timmer,
You make some very good points. I was unsure which is why I was inquiring about it. I think for me it would be better not to practice at the actual table. For the reasons you pointed out. I believe you could be correct that it could lead to some rule changes and would bring unnecessary scrutiny on the player. So, I thank you for this thoughtful post. Sometimes we need to be reminded that there are other GTC players out there and we set the stage for them or walk onto the stage that they set.

I got to say that I agree with Timmer on this. Throwing on a closed table on a cruise ship IMHO is a NO NO. Remember folks, you always want to look as much as you can of a gambler. Does a gambler take dice out of their pocket and throw them on a closed table? The obvious answer is NO, so why would you do it. Goldfinger said he practices in his room with a travel box. Just throwing the dice on your bed is also good. What your dice are doing in the air is what is important. the 7 is going to show, but if your dice look good traveling in the air, then you are ready to take their money!

Dominator